You discover what you thought you would never discover: your spouse, best friend, fellow parent and bed partner is having an extramarital affair.
Are you tongue-tied?
Or, do you give tongue-lashings?
Those who sign up for one of my coaching packages often suffer from one or the other, or they alternate between being tongue-tied one moment and hand out a tongue-lashing the next.
You are frozen with pain and fear. Fearful that what you might say will drive a deeper wedge and him/her to the OP (other person). Or, you don’t know what to say because your mush-like mind is swollen with confusion. And, so you say nothing.
Or, Your pain, hurt or rage is so great there is no containment. It comes out. It spews out. In desperation you flail, hoping something will hit the mark and create sanity, will somehow drive things back to what they predictably were.
People often find my coaching helpful because we fashion together “words to say” that slice the silence or quell the clamor. We come up with what I call Laser Phrases. Laser Phrases:
1. Are short and to the point. They cut down the verbiage and yet say something that is heard.
2. Speak the truth concisely. They cut to the core of what a person REALLY wants to say. This truth is spoken without rancor or judgment. It comes from the heart. It comes from the “higher” self. It penetrates and gives plenty of room for reflection.
3. Are specific to the kind of affair. For example, saying “I’m here for you” is appropriate for the affair, “I need to prove my desirability” and totally unhelpful for “I don’t want to say no.” Likewise, “I’m glad I’m not in your shoes” could be powerfully effective for “I don’t want to say no” and prove a setback for “I need to prove my desirability.”
4. Are spoken with body language, tone of voice, posture, etc. that uses “charging neutral,” one of the tools and skills I teach in my ebook. One speaks not as a wimp nor as a tyrant. One conveys the phrase in a way that communicates “You must deal with me.”
Here’s a coaching client who discovered her husband’s affair. He ended the affair and suffers from extreme guilt. She is feeling the betrayal and devastation and has hundreds of questions and wants to talk. He will respond often but at times she sees him staring into space. You can image what she thinks he might be thinking, which triggers floods of feelings and thoughts.
We are rehearsing how she might handle this situation. For example, she might try making a comment, gentle but direct: “I wonder where you just went to??? with perhaps a smile on her face. Or, “are you aware that you are distancing, or is it just me? “Is there anything I can do that will help you come back here?
Again, these possible Laser Phrases fit well the context of their extramarital affair.
Please understand that Laser Phrasing is easier said than done. It takes self awareness. It takes an understanding of the kind of affair that faces you. It takes rehearsal. It takes self acceptance.
I find that the type of affairs my husband has crosses over several of the Types and I can’t pinpoint one specific one. All of these Types have elements of my husbands affairs:
My Marriage made me do it.
I can’t say no
I don’t want to say NO
I fell out of love and just love being in love
I want to get back at her (for his emotional hurts from his past)
I need to prove my desirability
I want to be close to someone (which means I can’t stand intimacy)
Since there are different suggestions for the different types, I find it hard to prepare Laser Phrases (as well as following other suggestions for healing our marriage)
Hi J. Dr. Huizenga here. I feel a need to respond to you because you are not alone in trying to pinpoint the kind of affair facing you and formulating laser phrases that hit powerfully.
I often find that confusion and inability to target the kind of affair may mean:
1. The behavior you face may not be deeply ingrained. It’s scattered. And, that is often GOOD, since deeply ingrained and pronounced behaviors have been forming for some time and are often more difficult to change.
2. Difficulty in pinpointing the kind of affair often points to affair #7: I want to be close to someone, but cant stand intimacy. The trademark of this kind of affair is confusion, and often contains characteristics of the other kinds, especially “I can’t say no.”
3. There often is overlap in the kinds of affairs. Boxes are nice but relationships and human beings don’t often fit neatly in boxes. I suppose this is good! However, there are patterns which point to predictable behaviors. This is the strength of identify these 7 kinds of affairs.
4. The more time you spend trying to pinpoint the kinds of affair and behaviors, the more the clarity will emerge. You will have “ah ha” moments. The pieces of the puzzle will fall into place, sometimes gradually, other times quickly.
5. Use your “gut” or intuition to guide you in ferreting out the kind of affair. Your exposure to an affair relationship often dulls our intuition, or we learn not to trust it, but, it is often (almost always!) right on. Let it guide you.
6. Pick out a phrase, one that seems as if it might fit, and experiment. Try it. See what happens. Don’t go overboard, but throw it out and notice his/her response. If you hit the jackpot, pursue it. If the phrase falls on deaf ears or has minimal impact, try something else.
I hope this helps, not only you, but others trying to make sense out of a confusing and painful situation.
As someone who has myself cheated, even I can’t tell which type of cheat/unfaithful person I am. And I know my reasons and responses have changed over time. So I certainly wouldn’t expect my husband to work out which one I am since his rationality would already be severely tested by the upset.
I have feelings of boredom, entitlement, thrill-seeking, deep intimacy seeking (as in I am looking for the “perfect” lover with whom I can have the “perfect” romance without any of the reality/grind of marriage). I am by no means a superficial person and in fact many people enjoy talking to me because they find me open, insightful, analytical and down to earth. However, I realise that perhaps that only in this area of my life, i.e. marriage, I have childish and immature expectations. This is possibly due to growing up in an environment of my parents’ own selfishness in their marriage, where they wish that the other were something s/he simply is not and therefore constantly fight due to the disappointment. I was also a spoiled child and this lack of discipline may well account for acting in a way that is entirely selfish and self-centred.
Thank you Dr. Huizenga and Jenna for your comments. They are extremely helpful!
My husband(42) and a beautiful real estate agent(30) worked all summer on selling a spec house that my husband was involved in. While we never had a perfect marriage, it was workable. Suddenly this “successful career woman” came into the picture and my husband was constantly on the phone with her, spending time at the open houses and doing his best to exclude me, all the while angrily defending his “relationship” as a purely business arrangement. They “were trying to get the house sold!” I became the outsider, and our marriage spiraled downhilll quickly. I went from expressing concern, to accusing him of an out and out affair. He called me “insane” and all kinds of other attacks on my self worth, while he praised her and continued his phone conversations and “effforts” towards selling the house. Now he has moved out, and although he swears nothing inappropriate has gone on with this young lady, I feel otherwise. When he has withdrawn from OUR relationship, and he has thrown himself into this partnership with this woman, and developed a relationship with her to the detriment of our relationship, it is an emotional affair. I cannot get him to see this, and until I can get him to understand how incredibly damaging it has been (look at where we are now–separated and comtemplating divorce), we cannot get beyond the “elephant in the living room” as I call it. Where do you go from here?
Dr H’s “Top 10” tips which include taking care of yourself FIRST–and trying (learning) to stay “neutral” while stating who you are and what you need (have the right to expect from your spouse?) rather than falling apart &/or berating the ‘cheater’ over and over again is the best path to take. I’ve found that writing (email) helped both of us in getting some of our thoughts (expectations & disappointments) across and allowed us to start some discussion about fixing our marriage, though I still have concerns about what I hope is ‘only’ an emotional affair (with some secrecy & evasion still going on). Writing also allows for revision rather than ‘impulse’ dumping of pain & negativity–this safer ‘distance’ helps to keep your emotions from spiralling out of control “all over him” inappropriately…because if you write something you REALLY shouldn’t send (or say), the simple act of VENTING helps you feel better (& understand your fears)…Good luck & God bless–prayer plus strong friend/family support really help too! (things may not always be what they seem…worry may come from inside you, but intuition could also be a ‘valid’ warning to look into it further)
Interesting you should talk about the email. We have been separated for about a month now. Whenever we try to talk on the phone or in person, inevitably when the subject gets to this “person”, things deteriorate quickly. Email is perfect for us, and that is what we have been doing. I always express myself best in writing, especially when it is an emotional subject. Speaking ‘live’, I dont always take the time to think things through and sometimes just speak out of emotion. I write with emotion, but my thoughts come across clearer, and they clarify themselves for me too. WE can each read what we have written and reflect on it or re-read parts to really get the message.
My husband continues to defend and deny this relationship, but hopefully she will be mostly out of the picture, as the real estate venture is now under contract. My intuition tells me there was something going on, at least on my husbands part–whether it was a crush, intense admiration, or just a realization that he was really unhappy in his marriage, and the grass appeared greener. Whatever it was, as frustrating as it will be to deal with, he will NEVER admit to anything. His very Catholic upbringing tells him that adultry is against one of the 10 Commandments, and whatever his feelings are, either he denies them to himself or just denies them to me. Meanwhile I am working on my own issues and and TRYING to stay neutral. I dont do very well whenver the subject of this “friend” comes up though. That is where email helps.
Thanks and take care!
My husband did a similar thing with a “teacher”, 20 years my junior, at his athletic club. She was supposedly teaching him how to roller blade, so he could develop his glutes and become the best darn triathlete in the whole state…She’s so admiring. One day, while he was supposedly in a meeting, I got a bad feeling and called him on his cell. She picked it up and asked me to come pick him up at a local hospital, since he had hurt himself “a little” while they were roller-blading in the park! I asked to talk to him and was told that he was still asleep from the morphine! He had dislocated his shoulder. I guess she wasn’t such a good teacher!(And the morphine came in handy when I slugged him later!) But I told her this while unknown (to me)”thing,” of them going to the park during his working hours was NOT OK! She apologized, of course. As soon as he recovered, they were right beck at it, using his personal time to escape during his working hours for restaurant visits and who knows what else. He maintained that they were just “work out buddies” and just “friends.” This went on for another year, until he got so full of himself, what with her unlimited admiration and all, he thought all women existed for his warm regard and long, intimate conversations, and while flirting with yet another woman on a plane, I asked him if he wanted to switch seats with me so he could sit closer to her, and he proceeded to scream at me loudly for 30 minutes to the morbid entertainment of everyone around us. I quit wearing my wedding ring after that. He had a “realization” that he was having “an emotional affair” with this woman and putting me down helped to justify his unethical behavior. He promised to stop seeing her or contacting her in any way. That went on for 10 months, just until I signed off on a huge tax bill he had incurred and rented us a new house (infidelity is expensive — all those high-price athletic clubs and activities, including a $10,000 set of bicycles “caused” him to rack up a lot of high-interest debt and ruin our credit). Then one night I heard his cell phone vibrating, and looked at it, and it was a text message from the previous affairee, saying, “I know we had a meeting, I’m so sorry to miss it. I’ll explain all my reasons this weekend when I talk to you. I know you’ll understand. Hugs, etc.” This was a nasty surprise. So I called her up and said “Let’s meet.” She came and I asked her what her intentions were, and she started apologizing (again) and said she “hadn’t had feelings for my husband for about a year…” for starters. That would be since they’d stopped sneaking around. But she did have feelings, and that was the very thing he had always denied. I told him this and he was surprised at his ignorance (he wants me to believe). He promised it was over and would not continue, again. Within 3 hours, she had called him up and denied ever saying she had feelings for him, and much more, and he then turned on me and accused me of making the whole thing up and lying. Needless to say, some men’s fantasies of their own importance grow wayyyyy too big! After 15 years of abuse, I’m suddenly trying to TRICK him into NOT having another affair?!?!?!? Makes no sense. So once I got the dope to think it through, and he realized he’d been had, again, he began to think, ever so slowly. It takes 3 to have a quarrel. And the innocent-seeming, just-standing-by, secret ally of only one of the 2 quarrelling is usually the one promoting the whole thing. She wanted a man to give her an exciting affair to spice up her marriage. She thought the “grass was greener,” etc. I told her the grass was always greener over the septic tank. To treat me badly because some selfish, destructive prima donna wants to have a mid-life crisis is a load of crap, and they can go to a very dark place together or separately for all I care. What a lot of crap. Now my husband sees what a tool he was. Good for him. So do I. Ugh. Dumb is not attractive. As for “working on the marriage” — phooey. I’m taking care of myself. Doctor’s orders. These bastards have run me down almost to collapse, what with fibromyalgia, altitude sickness and a car wreck. Could they contribute any more to my well-being? Hah! I hope I survive to get out of here. These narcissistic a–holes suck.Thanks for letting me vent. No one in my own life can hear or cares to hear. That makes it not-so-easy, either. But after years of marriage, I’ve realized that I am very alone, and will be until I take matters into my own hands and create the circle of friends that can help me through crap like this. Which kind of stuff is not going to happen to me any more. I’ve learned so much. It is all about me, my life, what I attract and create. I let him in, I can let him go. I can get on with my life. Just ouch, though, ouch, ouch, ouch. They’re all “sorry” once they’ve indulged their fantasies. Eeeeeeew. Grow up people! We can all do better.
To Catherine,
Lying ALSO breaks one of the 10 Commandments! Having had a “very Catholic” upbringing as well – we were taught to obey ALL the Commandments – not allowed to pick and choose!
Seems as though perhaps he cannot admit to any wrong-doing on his part due to guilt rather than a passionate belief in the Ten Commandments.
Best of Luck!
“I let him in, I can let him go. I can get on with my life. Just ouch, though, ouch, ouch, ouch.”
Thank you Shirley! You described this experience for me perfectly, yet you retained an optimistic outlook–“that we can all do better.” How right you are!
My husband is having an affair. Because of the financial issues (he is still in school and acquiring debt that I do not want to be responsible for while he is with someone else), I decided to go ahead and file for divorce. He said it was rather abrupt and I told him that I was moving on and if we are meant to be together this divorce won’t change that. I believe his affair is primarily the “I fell out of love” reason but he may also have a problem saying no to her. It’s only been 2 weeks since I left (we had just moved to a new town so I needed to go back to where my support system is) and he doesn’t appear to miss me at all. He only contacts me about financial matters and only through e-mail. I am following his lead and not calling him or trying to talk to him because, although I have lots of things to say, I just don’t want to give him the ego boost of knowing that I miss him. I’ve been following all the “rules”…staying upbeat and happy when I have to see him, charging nuetral, and all the rest. I am going up to move my furniture this weekend and get papers signed. I’m just not sure I will have much more opportunity to interact with him and am wondering if there is anywhere else for me to go her? The book says to maintain contact in this case. Should I just send him a friendly little e-mail sometimes or what? I don’t want to call because I get too depressed when he doesn’t call back. How much contact with someone who appears to not want to talk to you is appropriate? I am trying to be patient but I just lost my very best friend in a horrible, terrible way. Please help.
Are you people idiots?? If he is still seeing this person, well then you need to leave. Have you no dignity. Even if there are children involved you leave. I think to sleep with him after her is repulsive. I hope to God you are not doing that. I have been cheated on before my marriage, but if my husband did it now he would be gone. Yes and we share children. What kind of example are you setting for them to walk around miserable. why do you always want to worry if he is done yet. He should have never did it. And now he needs to get it out of his system!! what a crock..grow up and learn to love Yourself. You are going to lose the person that matters most and no I don’t mean him I mean yourself. You are giving away your power and control by allowing this affair to continue. You tell him end it now or get out if he leaves, well then you were settling not him and let him walk the hell out it will hurt but in time hate heals all wounds. You need to take a good look at yourself and ask if you deserve this and of course you do not. Do not what if anything.. Just screw him..and move on if he cannot choose you. don’t you want to be first???
I have survived my husband’s emotional affair with a coworker. I believe we fall in the category of fallen out of love, but loved. Married for 20 years with three children. This was a childhood romance that has been the love of my life forever. For myself, I never experienced a great personal loss until this emotional affair occurred. I was absolutely devastated. Part of me isn’t so sure it was even more than an emotional affair? However,the largest thing we’ve noted is my husband’s NEED to help others. And unfortunately it seems to be those people that have significant relationship problems or problems in their own life. He’s a great guy. Easy to talk to for the most part. However, he becomes emotionally drawn into their “psycho babble” and then months later becomes another’s stepping stone for their problems. After realizing how detrimental this is to OUR relationship and his emotional attachment to another being due to perhaps his own feelings for being needed as well. He admits to trying hard to have an affair with her and was planning to leave me. I have realized I can’t be supermom. He’s behaviors have left me extremely depressed. I have developed a mentality of self-doubt, depression,and in general stuck in not being able to move past this problem in my own mind. He appears to be working hard at making changes. He’s a great dad. We’ve made more time for ourselves. I notice a lot of new behaviours that should make me extremely happy. However, I am just stuck in the past and have a hard time with trust and allowing myself to be hurt again. It’s signficant to be able to “put yourself out there” for another possible failure. To do so would be allowing yourself to be hurt all over again. That’s where I am in our relationship.
I will say that ultimatums NEVER work. It does take time to distance yourself from the other person. He’s had a hard time of doing this, and not until he saw the hurt it caused me nor that she wasn’t possibly all gold either. Also, until I became able to stick up for myself and let him know I wasn’t a doormat and wouldn’t accept his behaviours and he KNEW it, nothing changed. When he saw changes in me then I saw changes in him. I think it can work with HARD work. Perhaps at this point more work on my part than my husbands?
Thanks for your comments. They have helped me significantly over the last year.
I’ve lived a nightmare and now I am picking up the pieces of a life the Atomic Bomb Destroyed. Lived with my husband for two years of madness, he was acting like a psycho, I was reading on passive aggressive, bipolar etc… He was never home and when he was he spoke under his breath. He wouldn’t eat with the family instead would make a tuna or cheese sandwich. When trying to speak to his he would scream, “go away leave me alone.” He slept on the couch under many pillows and blankets. Went shopping at local stores for hours only to come home with nothing. Approach him on this and he would get angry. I’d speak to his sister and when I would suggest a mental illness she would say, “I don’t think it’s that.” Push led to shove, I feared him and would sleep with a 24″ piece of closet pole next to my bed at night. People were saying they were worried he’d kill me and the children as he was not well. Pushed into a divorce I signed the papers in my favor for Constructive Abandonment. Nasty divorce forced me into having to file for support as he no longer made deposits in the joint accounts. Our savings were depleted by $2,000 per month and I have no idea how long this went on because he snuck all the documents out of our home. Three months after the hearing I find out he was having an affair with his brother’s wife’s little sister. Set up for a great fall, and I feel hard, his sister claimed I’d want more money from him and that is why she lied. After receiving the court order for support his OP called me and harassed me sometimes nearly 20 times in a day. Spoke to the police, my attorney and no one helped me. During the first holidays apart was the worse. She’d call and say “he never loved you, never wanted to marry you, never wanted our two sons or our home.” She claimed I trapped him. She said, “They were in love and found true happiness.” She is 18 years younger then him, two small children and was in a process of divorce herself. Her husband was a dead beat dad. After receiving numerous calls of which I felt were a three way, I drove to my husbands apartment to confront him. We spoke, had several beers, I left after finding a photo of them both in a heart frame and her children’s clothing and her panties in his dryer. I got pulled over and was arrested for DWI. I lost my license, and I had just completed the real-estate course. She was arrested for aggravated harassment shortly afterwards but not soon enough as the damage to me was done. I now have a misdemeanor and three years probation, a woman who never had a record in her life until my husbands infidelity and the trauma it caused me. I am sixty-thousand dollars in debt. I have no work history, no education other than a high school diploma. He has an MBA that the courts say is worth nothing. I am in college and will God willing receive my Associates May 2007, I work in a dollar store for $7.50 per hour, it is local. It’s been one and one half years since the preliminary hearing, the Attorneys milked me into debt. Paying the cards forced me to charge my groceries and clothing increasing the debt each month as I used all my money to pay the minimum payments. I am in an out patient program ordered by the courts. I’ve learned so much about the other side of the world that involves drugs and alcohol. I am with people I would never even had spoken to or associated with. Some real criminals, who have killed people, robbed them by knife or gun point. I go home shaking, then I go to work, then I go to college. I am trying so hard the bills keep adding up and I keep pushing forward with earning $200.00 per week only to come home to another bill for my DWI. It has cost me $8,000 and is rising, on top of a dead beat Attorney which cost me $20,000. I replaced them with another who took a $3,500 retainer. Before my preliminary hearing my boss tried to rape me and was arrested for forceable touching. I guess the predator goes for the weak. It is a miracle from God that I can still hold my head up proudly. I live in today as tomorrow hurts me and my future scares me. I lost out on my sons last football season as I was only able to see one hour of one game. So much of my life and what I loved was taken away from me from my husbands involvement with a needy woman twenty years younger than me. I’ve been married for 19 years and sacrificed my life for my family’s betterment and I am left at the age of 47 to try to make something of it. I was a free spirited woman, so happy go lucky. Loved my life, my family, my pets. I’ve cried more then I’ve laughed these last few years. I want me back.
Now my husband is speaking normally, like the man I knew before he changed. He is reaching out to help and shows true signs of sincerity and understanding of what his affair has done to my life and how it jeopardized our sons college education. He ran around with this young woman for two or more years, I will never know the real time line. True happiness, in love, bicycle riding, skiing, trips to Dominican Republic, ski resorts with her children. Showered her with jewelry, put her on a pedestal for what?? A full blown inconsiderate mid-life crisis on steroids that cost us both a fortune financially and endless heartache and sorrow. For what? To find out that the grass is not greener on the other side, and not only is it not greener they don’t even own a lawn mower.
I never had any nice furniture, I always was hopeful we’d be in a position to redo our home. When in the process of it all hell breaks loose, I lived for one year with cement floors and open walls. We were in the process of redoing our home when this woman came in-between us. I worked 16 hours a day fixing our home with the thought that my Christmas tree is not going on cement floors. I cleared our property, took down trees and threw out years over years of garbage. I fixed a home that was neglected by my husband only afterwards to find out I had carpal tunnel in my hands. It has been one obstacle after another, and I survived, I am hurt without a doubt. Those big silent tears saturate my face at times but I push them away and get up and push forward into a future that I don’t see. I am blind, but I have faith and hope that keeping positive and doing the right thing for me and my sons will keep the negative away and allow me to live in peace one day.
Woman who get involved with family men have a ton of nerve. They think it is a game sneaking around but all they do is destroy lives. There are plenty of unwed men in this world available for them. Especially the one involved in my life as she is merely 28 years old, why go after a man who is married and twenty years older then you. Why ruin what two people worked at all their lives, why jeopardize two wonderful boys futures for your own selfishness. At 28 you do not have the experience to understand sacrifice, that is what a family undergoes in order to obtain a future. For you to get involved and be a negative force in taking it away should make you ashamed of yourself!
My husband and I have been married for 24 years. 6 years ago he cheated on me with a 24 year old girl, at that time my husband was 40, and they live together for 3 month in california while I was in Ohio. He told me the reason why hi did it is because I did not give him passion nor intimacy and the girl that he was with give him all that. I went to California to get him and we got back together, after 5 years of getting back together and now he is doing it again. On Friday afternoon he called me at work telling me that he moved out of the house I was so heart by what hi did that I did not know what to do. Later that night I found out the reason he moved out is because he went to visit her at her country at (Indonisia), when he called me I big him over and over again to come back to me and he refuses too. Was I wrong to big him to come back? even thought he cheated on me twice? even now that I know where he is I still want him back. What is wrong with me? please help me. All my friends told me to get rid of him and start a new life but I don’t know how start doing that, I don’t know where to start. I told my husband that I would changes for him and that I would do what ever he wanted me to do, but he is telling me that is to late for me to change and he found a 36 year old women that can make him happy in bed and would give him passion and intimacy. What is wrong with me that I cannot let him go just like that, why do I big him over and over again to come back. After I was done bigging him to come back I felt like I lowered myself to nothing. I don’t know if there is hope for me anymore.
Dear R:
Let him go! Keep busy so you can ease your mind and refrain from dwelling on it. Stop crying, stop pleading find your self-esteem again. Woman seem to do everything for men and their children. It is most of what we know, we always place ourselves last and then wonder why we can’t stand on our own two feet. It is a process that depletes our self-esteem slowly year by year that we don’t even notice it’s gone. All I personally knew was family, holidays. It is what I lived for and worked for. After my husbands affair and me having him ordered out of our home I started to feel the loss of what I worked at for 20 years. That partnership of doing things together, I now found myself without. Many people helped me, and I was grateful only it was not the same. I felt like I lost a piece of myself, my life. And bottom line is I DID!
You need now to find ways to fill that void and the first step is to keep busy to ease your mind up. Little by little that void will be filled with other things in your life that make you happy and feel good about yourself. To be thrown into the world without a life jacket is difficult. It is a struggle, but once you find a solid ground it can be a blessing. You will find yourself, you will make your own decisions and not have to answer to him or others. It will be a new found freedom one of which we lost while busy with our husbands and families. Just a walk through a park with just yourself feeling wonderful and enjoying the world will make you realize that some lessons as hard as they are can be worth GOLD! Now you keep strong, focus and keep busy because you will bloom. Like a rose, beautiful, delicate and self protected.
To Marie
I know just how you feel My OP wasnt even 28 she was only 18 and in her final year of highschool. We had 6 kids and I thought after giving him such a large beautiful family he would take care of me. He got her pregnant and left and I had to fight for everything. I am in far more debt to this day than I can ever dig out of and have no where to go and nothing to look forward to. Everyone says at least you have your kids but eventually they leave to and chances are your ex becomes the hero because they are not there doing all the work and discipling and are able to come through for the kids at their leisure. It sucks so what if I have them who wants a woman with 6 kids no one thats who, my life is over and am only going through the motions and not even sure why holding on to some kind of invisible hope I guess. This girl told me I should go feed my fn kids and called me all kinds of names , I will never forget this as long as I live I can only hope the same happens to her one day for her to see how someone can ruin the lives of others and for my 6 kids to go through life with this as an example they are very bitter and have little faith. all for his selfishness that continues all the wile telling them how much he loves them like thats enough. Can I dump the responsibility of raising them and just say I love you too and it will all be okay why is it so unfair. He couldnt even get joint custody because the courts wouldnt allow it because of the way he abandoned us and the length of time he did not contact the kids(3yrs) but of course he claims that is all my fault and now he is supposedly stronger and capapble and now they are married and so happy yeehaw for them how nice that you can poo on everyone say your sorry and not perfect and Ilove you and all is forgotton. It makes you wonder sometimes if you should do the same and you will get the same respect is that what it takes to get respect Im beginnign to wonder really Its such a cruel world